Hey at least you guys get to see it a reasonable hour [}:)] - plays here from just after midnight till wee hours. Unfortunately work means sleep comes first[V][V][V][V][:(]
Chris
NZL1 Longtack
NZL110 Swept Away NZL128 Ketch me if U Can
America's Cup
Moderators: Capt. Flak, bigfoot55, Chuck Luscomb
41 posts
• Page 2 of 3 • 1, 2, 3
by RMDJBD » Mon May 14, 2007 8:11 pm
Joe
You don't work from home????? It was nice laying up a Deck and Hull and having a cup of hot coffee and a donut at the same time.
I think Jobson was much better than these guys, they need to go back to sailing.
Bob Dudinsky
R.M.D.MARINE
You don't work from home????? It was nice laying up a Deck and Hull and having a cup of hot coffee and a donut at the same time.
I think Jobson was much better than these guys, they need to go back to sailing.
Bob Dudinsky
R.M.D.MARINE
- RMDJBD
- Posts: 87
- Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2003 10:58 am
- Location:
by Capt. Flak » Tue May 15, 2007 11:03 am
WOW! I can't wait to get home and see the tape of this race. I heard it on the internet radio feed. What a come back.
I got to get Tivo.
Joe Walter #24
I got to get Tivo.
Joe Walter #24
-
Capt. Flak - Posts: 2070
- Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2003 10:30 am
by Capt. Flak » Fri May 18, 2007 11:35 am
If anyone had told me that Luna Rosa would be leading 3-1 against BMW/Oracle, I would have laughed in their face.
Maybe there are too many Kiwis on board. [:D]
Maybe they never took the Italians serious. DUMB.
Joe Walter #24
Maybe there are too many Kiwis on board. [:D]
Maybe they never took the Italians serious. DUMB.
Joe Walter #24
-
Capt. Flak - Posts: 2070
- Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2003 10:30 am
by IanHB » Sat May 19, 2007 4:16 am
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Capt. Flak</i>
Maybe there are too many Kiwis on board. [:D]
Joe Walter #24
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Sir, would you care to elaborate on this comment?
DO IT NOW, Before it`s to late
Maybe there are too many Kiwis on board. [:D]
Joe Walter #24
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Sir, would you care to elaborate on this comment?
DO IT NOW, Before it`s to late
- IanHB
- Posts: 43
- Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2003 2:17 am
- Location:
by Capt. Flak » Sat May 19, 2007 12:45 pm
No disrespect to the Kiwis. We all know their talents and that is why there are so many of them sailing on just about every boat. But just maybe their hearts are not in it to win for a billionaire American.
I think every team out there should have at least some measure of National pride and identity.
ETNZ are the only team with a majority of their own nationality on board. They have a couple of non-Kiwis, but that is about it. All the other teams are dominated by hired guns. I just think that that does not promote the real idea of the event, which is a friendly race between Nations.
It is a money driven quest to bring the REAL prize of the $billion revenue to the winners home port.
If I could change one rule about this event, it would be to make the skipper and the afterguard citizens of the Country they are sailing for. The hired guns can be the crew, but the guys calling the shots should be Americans on the American boat, Kiwis on the Kiwi boat and so on.
Of course I could just have sour grapes because the American boat is having its butt handed to them by an Italian team with an Auzzie skipper and Brazilian tactician.
Maybe I would not be so upset if the "dictator from down under" would at least open his ears to Brady, Isler, and Kolb.
There are 11 guys from NZL on the American boat and only 3 Americans. There are 15 guys from NZL on the NZL boat.
Chris Dickson gets paid, win or lose. There is nothing in this for him except maybe to keep his job one more time for another failed attempt. And how many failures will that be for him...FOUR...FIVE...? Ellison should have never fired Cayard.
Ok, I am done venting.[:(]
Joe Walter #24
I think every team out there should have at least some measure of National pride and identity.
ETNZ are the only team with a majority of their own nationality on board. They have a couple of non-Kiwis, but that is about it. All the other teams are dominated by hired guns. I just think that that does not promote the real idea of the event, which is a friendly race between Nations.
It is a money driven quest to bring the REAL prize of the $billion revenue to the winners home port.
If I could change one rule about this event, it would be to make the skipper and the afterguard citizens of the Country they are sailing for. The hired guns can be the crew, but the guys calling the shots should be Americans on the American boat, Kiwis on the Kiwi boat and so on.
Of course I could just have sour grapes because the American boat is having its butt handed to them by an Italian team with an Auzzie skipper and Brazilian tactician.
Maybe I would not be so upset if the "dictator from down under" would at least open his ears to Brady, Isler, and Kolb.
There are 11 guys from NZL on the American boat and only 3 Americans. There are 15 guys from NZL on the NZL boat.
Chris Dickson gets paid, win or lose. There is nothing in this for him except maybe to keep his job one more time for another failed attempt. And how many failures will that be for him...FOUR...FIVE...? Ellison should have never fired Cayard.
Ok, I am done venting.[:(]
Joe Walter #24
-
Capt. Flak - Posts: 2070
- Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2003 10:30 am
by RMDJBD » Sat May 19, 2007 1:13 pm
Joe
I am having trouble with the Nationality issue too, I think any country that enters the Americas cup race that all crew and skipper be of that country period.
Don't forget in the old days the Cup Boats had to sail on their own bottoms to the Race Venue, could you envision this today.
ITA and NZL in semi, and ITA going to the finals.
Bob Dudinsky
R.M.D.MARINE
I am having trouble with the Nationality issue too, I think any country that enters the Americas cup race that all crew and skipper be of that country period.
Don't forget in the old days the Cup Boats had to sail on their own bottoms to the Race Venue, could you envision this today.
ITA and NZL in semi, and ITA going to the finals.
Bob Dudinsky
R.M.D.MARINE
- RMDJBD
- Posts: 87
- Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2003 10:58 am
- Location:
by Capt. Flak » Sat May 19, 2007 4:22 pm
Well I was dead wrong on my predictions, so I am not going to go down that path again. Jim Beam is not cheap.[B)]
A quick history lesson though if I may. In the real old days of the cup, they did have hired hands to work the decks. Most of them were Norwegians for both America and the challengers. The main part was the boat was designed and built in the country of origin, by citizens of that country. Then the boat was sailed by skipper and afterguard from that country. The rich back then looked the other way at crew. They simply saw them as laborers and servants.
I am fine with hired crew, but the command and control should be from that country.
But having said that, if the rules did go back to that, the New Zealanders would own the cup for the next 132 years.[xx(]
Joe Walter #24
A quick history lesson though if I may. In the real old days of the cup, they did have hired hands to work the decks. Most of them were Norwegians for both America and the challengers. The main part was the boat was designed and built in the country of origin, by citizens of that country. Then the boat was sailed by skipper and afterguard from that country. The rich back then looked the other way at crew. They simply saw them as laborers and servants.
I am fine with hired crew, but the command and control should be from that country.
But having said that, if the rules did go back to that, the New Zealanders would own the cup for the next 132 years.[xx(]
Joe Walter #24
-
Capt. Flak - Posts: 2070
- Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2003 10:30 am
by Rick West » Sat May 19, 2007 9:14 pm
Well said, Joe. I felt the Cup would never leave NZL and was shocked when the best of NZL did. This is not right and may go like the football stadiums in the US to named company names.
Maybe the next challenge will have a Google boat. Ridiculous but if you have the money many will flaunt it without national pride.
...94![[8D]](./images/smilies/icon_cool.gif "Cool")
Maybe the next challenge will have a Google boat. Ridiculous but if you have the money many will flaunt it without national pride.
...94
-
Rick West - Posts: 3204
- Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2003 8:53 pm
- Location: San Francisco, CA
by Capt. Flak » Sun May 20, 2007 11:17 am
I am now rooting for the Spanish. Viva España![8D]
Joe Walter #24
Joe Walter #24
-
Capt. Flak - Posts: 2070
- Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2003 10:30 am
by IanHB » Sun May 20, 2007 9:56 pm
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Capt. Flak</i>
No disrespect to the Kiwis. We all know their talents and that is why there are so many of them sailing on just about every boat. But just maybe their hearts are not in it to win for a billionaire American.
I think every team out there should have at least some measure of National pride and identity.
ETNZ are the only team with a majority of their own nationality on board. They have a couple of non-Kiwis, but that is about it. All the other teams are dominated by hired guns. I just think that that does not promote the real idea of the event, which is a friendly race between Nations.
It is a money driven quest to bring the REAL prize of the $billion revenue to the winners home port.
If I could change one rule about this event, it would be to make the skipper and the afterguard citizens of the Country they are sailing for. The hired guns can be the crew, but the guys calling the shots should be Americans on the American boat, Kiwis on the Kiwi boat and so on.
Of course I could just have sour grapes because the American boat is having its butt handed to them by an Italian team with an Auzzie skipper and Brazilian tactician.
Maybe I would not be so upset if the "dictator from down under" would at least open his ears to Brady, Isler, and Kolb.
There are 11 guys from NZL on the American boat and only 3 Americans. There are 15 guys from NZL on the NZL boat.
Chris Dickson gets paid, win or lose. There is nothing in this for him except maybe to keep his job one more time for another failed attempt. And how many failures will that be for him...FOUR...FIVE...? Ellison should have never fired Cayard.
Ok, I am done venting.[:(]
Joe Walter #24
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
<font size="2">Sir, with the greatest respect I would suggest that your venting is ill informed, bigoted
(Blindly and obstinately attached to some creed or opinion and intolerant toward others) and indeed may even be libelous.
To insinuate that a member of any team may not be doing their very best for that team is not within your sphere of knowledge and does you no service as a sportsman or a fair minded citizen of any country.
May I also remind you that the teams competing for the Louis Vuitton Cup are not "national" teams but represent yacht clubs.
So it is a team from the San Fransisco Yacht Club, Royal Yacht Squadron Auckland, or Naples Yacht Club that you may choose to support, or not as you wish.
What then matters the original nationality of any members of the team. They have been living and working together for three or more years and their lives and that of their families are dedicated to one all consuming goal, the winning of that one hundred guinea cup.
Only one group can win the Americia`s Cup.
Regardless of your own personal opinion of the cup and all it`s expence and associated hullabloo it will be considered as the pinnicle of yacht racing for long after we are both gone.
To be part of the winning team is the highest achievment in yachting and to suggest that
any team members "heart is not in it" shows a complete lack of understanding of the commitment of these people.
To be a true "Sportsman" one needs to be able to both win and lose with dignity, humility, decorum and self respect.
Losing is something we all do throughout our lives, to lose with dignity is the mark of a true gentleman in my opinion.
There will always be more losers than winners that is the nature of life.
Personalities of individuals is what all this is about, not nationalities.
Larry Ellison hired Chris Dickson to do a job for him, if he did his best but was beaten by a better team then just take it on the chin.
Respectfully,
Ian Hull-Brown.
DO IT NOW, Before it`s to late<font size="2"></font id="size2"></font id="size2">
No disrespect to the Kiwis. We all know their talents and that is why there are so many of them sailing on just about every boat. But just maybe their hearts are not in it to win for a billionaire American.
I think every team out there should have at least some measure of National pride and identity.
ETNZ are the only team with a majority of their own nationality on board. They have a couple of non-Kiwis, but that is about it. All the other teams are dominated by hired guns. I just think that that does not promote the real idea of the event, which is a friendly race between Nations.
It is a money driven quest to bring the REAL prize of the $billion revenue to the winners home port.
If I could change one rule about this event, it would be to make the skipper and the afterguard citizens of the Country they are sailing for. The hired guns can be the crew, but the guys calling the shots should be Americans on the American boat, Kiwis on the Kiwi boat and so on.
Of course I could just have sour grapes because the American boat is having its butt handed to them by an Italian team with an Auzzie skipper and Brazilian tactician.
Maybe I would not be so upset if the "dictator from down under" would at least open his ears to Brady, Isler, and Kolb.
There are 11 guys from NZL on the American boat and only 3 Americans. There are 15 guys from NZL on the NZL boat.
Chris Dickson gets paid, win or lose. There is nothing in this for him except maybe to keep his job one more time for another failed attempt. And how many failures will that be for him...FOUR...FIVE...? Ellison should have never fired Cayard.
Ok, I am done venting.[:(]
Joe Walter #24
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
<font size="2">Sir, with the greatest respect I would suggest that your venting is ill informed, bigoted
(Blindly and obstinately attached to some creed or opinion and intolerant toward others) and indeed may even be libelous.
To insinuate that a member of any team may not be doing their very best for that team is not within your sphere of knowledge and does you no service as a sportsman or a fair minded citizen of any country.
May I also remind you that the teams competing for the Louis Vuitton Cup are not "national" teams but represent yacht clubs.
So it is a team from the San Fransisco Yacht Club, Royal Yacht Squadron Auckland, or Naples Yacht Club that you may choose to support, or not as you wish.
What then matters the original nationality of any members of the team. They have been living and working together for three or more years and their lives and that of their families are dedicated to one all consuming goal, the winning of that one hundred guinea cup.
Only one group can win the Americia`s Cup.
Regardless of your own personal opinion of the cup and all it`s expence and associated hullabloo it will be considered as the pinnicle of yacht racing for long after we are both gone.
To be part of the winning team is the highest achievment in yachting and to suggest that
any team members "heart is not in it" shows a complete lack of understanding of the commitment of these people.
To be a true "Sportsman" one needs to be able to both win and lose with dignity, humility, decorum and self respect.
Losing is something we all do throughout our lives, to lose with dignity is the mark of a true gentleman in my opinion.
There will always be more losers than winners that is the nature of life.
Personalities of individuals is what all this is about, not nationalities.
Larry Ellison hired Chris Dickson to do a job for him, if he did his best but was beaten by a better team then just take it on the chin.
Respectfully,
Ian Hull-Brown.
DO IT NOW, Before it`s to late<font size="2"></font id="size2"></font id="size2">
- IanHB
- Posts: 43
- Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2003 2:17 am
- Location:
by Capt. Flak » Mon May 21, 2007 10:20 am
Ian, I had to roll my pants up to read your post. Dickson will always be a bride's maid. NZL has known this since 87, which is why he hasn't sailed under your flag since.
Joe Walter #24
Joe Walter #24
-
Capt. Flak - Posts: 2070
- Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2003 10:30 am
by IanHB » Mon May 21, 2007 7:14 pm
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Capt. Flak</i>
Ian, I had to roll my pants up to read your post. Dickson will always be a bride's maid. NZL has known this since 87, which is why he hasn't sailed under your flag since.
Joe Walter #24
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Joe, Yes finally we agree.
Chris Dickson was hired by Larry Ellison and both must take responsibility for the results.
Chris has a certain reputation in NZL and many were suprised when he was appointed not just helmsman but CEO and all the other positions he held as well.
My perhaps over the top response to your post was to defend all those who have devoted their lives to winning the cup for the BMW Oracle team (and the others) for the last four years and now must be heartbroken at their elimination from the competition.
Spare a thought for them and their families and their futures.
I am sorry the reference to rolling your pants up eludes me. Must be a colloquialism?
DO IT NOW, Before it`s to late
Ian, I had to roll my pants up to read your post. Dickson will always be a bride's maid. NZL has known this since 87, which is why he hasn't sailed under your flag since.
Joe Walter #24
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Joe, Yes finally we agree.
Chris Dickson was hired by Larry Ellison and both must take responsibility for the results.
Chris has a certain reputation in NZL and many were suprised when he was appointed not just helmsman but CEO and all the other positions he held as well.
My perhaps over the top response to your post was to defend all those who have devoted their lives to winning the cup for the BMW Oracle team (and the others) for the last four years and now must be heartbroken at their elimination from the competition.
Spare a thought for them and their families and their futures.
I am sorry the reference to rolling your pants up eludes me. Must be a colloquialism?
DO IT NOW, Before it`s to late
- IanHB
- Posts: 43
- Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2003 2:17 am
- Location:
by MichaelJ2K » Mon May 21, 2007 7:58 pm
"Rolling up your pants" means you don't want to get them dirty if you know what I mean.
Yes, I believe that Chris Dickson, although a good sailor, bit off more than he could chew. Even Dennis Conner stepped off the boat to manage the Stars and Stripes syndicate and let someone else do the driving. It's a shame that it happened but what you didn't see behind closed doors may have been turmoil for the team. The Cup coverage seems to put the helmsman in the limelight which can be quite a load. It's hard enough to sail a boat in a critical match and still try to perform as a CEO. It was just too many hats to wear. I'd love to have the cohones to go out there and do what they do!
Mike Denest
EC12 #899
Yes, I believe that Chris Dickson, although a good sailor, bit off more than he could chew. Even Dennis Conner stepped off the boat to manage the Stars and Stripes syndicate and let someone else do the driving. It's a shame that it happened but what you didn't see behind closed doors may have been turmoil for the team. The Cup coverage seems to put the helmsman in the limelight which can be quite a load. It's hard enough to sail a boat in a critical match and still try to perform as a CEO. It was just too many hats to wear. I'd love to have the cohones to go out there and do what they do!
Mike Denest
EC12 #899
-
MichaelJ2K - Posts: 272
- Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2003 9:44 pm
- Location:
41 posts
• Page 2 of 3 • 1, 2, 3
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 15 guests